Andrea Bottaro posted Entry 2295 on May 22, 2006 01:28 PM.
Trackback URL: http://www.pandasthumb.org/cgi-bin/mt/mt-tb.fcgi/2290

This is really funny. It seems that claiming expertise in “design detection” theory and methods is no guarantee against falling for the crudest of urban legends. Of course, it helps if the urban legend is based on stuff that pushes the religious right’s buttons (although, we are told, ID has nothing to do with religion-based political movements!), such as a story about praying marines being under attack by the ACLU.

Dembski’s blog got snookered by a silly chain e-mail to post the following entry, which I copy in its glorious entirety after the fold (caution: large) so that everyone can appreciate the imaginative use of fonts, caps and pompous rhetoric, which alone should have set off some alarm bells (note also the boisterous approval by Dembski himself in the comments). Ironically, this urban legend was already completely debunked in 2003 (see here and here), so here’s my suggestion, folks: if your design detection methods clearly need some tuning, you can still avoid looking foolish by simply checking the relevant literature.

Here’s a reproduction of the page, for historical purposes (a couple additional pictures of praying marines, several links and ads were cut for space reasons).
UD page.JPG

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Comment #101735

Posted by rubble on May 22, 2006 12:44 PM (e)

As of this writing, there’re three comments over at UD, warning that this is a hoax. Look for the UD entry to come down very quickly …

Comment #101736

Posted by Rich on May 22, 2006 12:45 PM (e)

Tune in to uncommonly dense next week, when DaveScot will show you:

• How he’s helping a Nigerian prince come to the US by sending him cash so that he can share his fortune
• How he reconfirmed his credit card and social security details via unsolicited email
• How ‘Hotgrl99’ (who apparently knows him) sent him ‘funny_Joke.exe’ and he’s opening it now
• How he trying to locate his arse with both hands…

He used to work for Dell, dontchaknow. I suspect they used have experts watch him browse the web and open emails so they could, erm, Idiot-proof things.

Seriously. These guys are experts at telling us stuff where things came from / how they were made?

*falls of chair, tears streaming from eyes*

Comment #101737

Posted by steve s on May 22, 2006 12:46 PM (e)

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHA

Comment #101738

Posted by Sounder on May 22, 2006 12:52 PM (e)

Man, he’s gotten really brazen religion on his web page now that his con is exposed.

Also,

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Comment #101739

Posted by Caledonian on May 22, 2006 12:55 PM (e)

Lord, watch over these troops as they do unto the least of your servants, bless them as they incarcerate dangerous elements of Iraqi society and administer unto them Your justice, guide them in their faithful punishment of Saddam Hussein for his part in the attacks on us, and reattach not the ears and limbs of those who raise hands against us.

Comment #101740

Posted by Rich on May 22, 2006 12:55 PM (e)

Or, maybe it’s a ruse; he’s using ‘street theatre’ to show how corally-corrupt-atheist-darwinists are anti war. Or something.

Comment #101741

Posted by Matt on May 22, 2006 12:56 PM (e)

How is this different from any of the other fabrications they’ve posted recently?

Also, they seem to have generally gone to just the one argument over there:

We don’t like [what we think are] the social implications of evolution being correct,
(therefore) evolution is not correct.

Making this kind of argument seems to be one of the features that differentiates logic from apologetics.

Comment #101742

Posted by steve s on May 22, 2006 12:57 PM (e)

LOL now davetard has erased some things, and offers a new interpretation:

#2

To everyone who’s pointed out that the ACLU story is a fabrication according to snopes.com - that’s hardly the point. The pictures of Marines praying are real. The fighting and dying to protect the interests of the United States is real. The request to pray for them is real. So I think I’ll just echo the supposedly non-existent Colonel Fessender and say, from the very real former Marine Sergeant David Springer, “Screw the ACLU and screw anyone who’s got a problem with this post.”

HOO RAH! Semper Fi!

Comment by DaveScot — May 22, 2006 @ 12:49 pm

Comment #101743

Posted by Matt on May 22, 2006 12:59 PM (e)

Did DaveScot acutally say that the fact that this

“story is a fabrication…[is] hardly the point” ?

Of course he did.

Comment #101744

Posted by Rich on May 22, 2006 1:00 PM (e)

Ooh, cat’s out of the bag:

“To everyone who’s pointed out that the ACLU story is a fabrication according to snopes.com - that’s hardly the point. The pictures of Marines praying are real. The fighting and dying to protect the interests of the United States is real. The request to pray for them is real. So I think I’ll just echo the supposedly non-existent Colonel Fessender and say, from the very real former Marine Sergeant David Springer, “Screw the ACLU and screw anyone who’s got a problem with this post.”

HOO RAH! Semper Fi!

Comment by DaveScot — May 22, 2006 @ 12:49 pm “

No Dave, the point is Uncommon Descent is supposed to be about science and discovering where things come from. So you publishing a fake, religious diatribe speaks volumes to your credibility.

Comment #101745

Posted by steve s on May 22, 2006 1:03 PM (e)

No Dave, the point is Uncommon Descent is supposed to be about science and discovering where things come from. So you publishing a fake, religious diatribe speaks volumes to your credibility.

Amusingly, one of their posts is titled “Natural Selection — losing credibility fast”

Comment #101746

Posted by Andrea Bottaro on May 22, 2006 1:03 PM (e)

“Sure we are making stuff up, but that’s hardly the point, because we’re right anyway.”

Comment #101747

Posted by Rich on May 22, 2006 1:08 PM (e)

/> SLEEPER AGENT DAVESCOT: ***REACTIVATED***

/>NEW PRIMARY OBJECTIVE: POST EASILY ESPOSED RIGHT WING CHRISTIAN LIES

Comment #101748

Posted by Mateo on May 22, 2006 1:24 PM (e)

This man needs a reality show. Fox, make it happen.

Comment #101749

Posted by Rich on May 22, 2006 1:29 PM (e)

Update 3:

“To everyone who’s pointed out that the ACLU story is a fabrication according to snopes.com - that’s hardly the point. The pictures of Marines praying are real. The fighting and dying to protect the interests of the United States is real. The request to pray for them is real. So I removed the fake names, noted the ACLU statement is rumor, and quoted a very real former Marine Sergeant’s sentiments instead. If anyone has a problem with that they can KMA. Google that.

HOO RAH! Semper Fi! “

It’s not a ‘rumour’, Dave, its false. BELLEND.

Comment #101750

Posted by Matt on May 22, 2006 1:37 PM (e)

I just noticed the tag line:

Of all the gifts you could give a Marine, US Soldier, Sailor, Airman &others deployed in harm’s way, Prayer is the very best one!

I’m not in the military, but if I were deployed in harm’s way I’d probably rather have the gift of body armor. That, and a guarantee that my deployment wouldn’t be indefinite.

Comment #101752

Posted by steve s on May 22, 2006 1:45 PM (e)

Watching the Intelligent Design flameout is pretty amusing.

Comment #101753

Posted by Rich on May 22, 2006 1:53 PM (e)

With regard to Davescot’s “The pictures of Marines praying are real”, he doesn’t know this as a fact. The top one looks photo-shopped to me. The depth cues certainly ‘feel’ wrong. Oh, I know, I’ll use my explanatory filter* to find out:

http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/upload/2006/05/ef20.gif

Comment #101754

Posted by Sir_Toejam on May 22, 2006 1:57 PM (e)

Dembski’s blog got snookered by a silly chain e-mail

hmm. did they now?

While I’m sure Dave scott springer, oh he of the imaginary talk show, could easily be fooled by drivel like this; the fact that Dembski chose this particular imagery and text to post a wish to pray for troops is interesting.

What if Dembski KNEW this was a hoax?

He’s posted this kind of stuff before.

Can anybody think of an alternative to why he might have posted that specific, well known hoax, than he is just a dimbulb?

I can think of a few.

We can still use parsimony to conclude what is obvious (dimbulb theory) and explore other possibilities simultaneously.

Comment #101755

Posted by Nick Matzke on May 22, 2006 2:00 PM (e)

Note that the first google hit on “David Springer ACLU” is to an old PT post, a comment in which refers to “DaveScot aka Dave Springer aka David Scott Springer.”

Comment #101756

Posted by steve s on May 22, 2006 2:07 PM (e)

To everyone who’s pointed out that the ACLU story is a fabrication according to snopes.com - that’s hardly the point. The pictures of Marines praying are real.

I’m not a photoshop expert, but the pic certainly does look a little suspecious. ed brayton says

P.S. And by the way, even the first picture, the huge one of all the marines praying, is faked - and badly, I might add. It’s a doctored photo of the same 3 or 4 guys copied over and over until it looks like hundreds of guys.

Comment #101757

Posted by Whatever on May 22, 2006 2:08 PM (e)

Relating to the movie, “Stripes” (w/ Bill Murray), I know that in times of trouble, our troops can count on DaveScot to always stand* behind them……directly behind, that is.

Comment #101758

Posted by steve s on May 22, 2006 2:18 PM (e)

and who didn’t see this coming?

#3

The ACLU has certainly stood against prayer in public school even if led by students in extra-curricular settings like graduation ceremonies and football games. There is not one iota of doubt in my mind that the ACLU would love to do the same thing to prayer in the military. Prayers led by commissioned and non-commissioned officers in the Corps are common. The military builds and maintains chapels on military bases. They employ religious clerics whose job is spiritual counseling and leading worship services. Anyone that thinks the ACLU wouldn’t stand against that if they could get away with it needs their head examined. They simply know the American public wouldn’t tolerate it and the ACLU would be so harmed they might never recover as an organization. So they bite their anti-religious tongues in the interest of self-preservation.

Comment by DaveScot — May 22, 2006 @ 1:59 pm

and someone promptly smacks him down, in a comment which probably won’t last long, so I reproduce it here:

#4

The ACLU has taken many religious freedom cases including definding churches and conservative Christians, including Jerry Fallwell. The ACLU has also defended the right of students to form prayer and Bible study clubs in school and both are ubiquitous at least in the south.

None of the Marines depicted are forcing other people to pray. I can only assume that *they* are not being forced to pray, but are doing so of their own free will. Students are free to pray at any time during a football game or a graduation ceremony. They are NOT free to force others to pray or to force others to listen to them pray. I can never quite understand why forced prayer is so desirable. Certainly it pleases the person doing the forcing, but I can’t imagine that it would please God.

Comment by MrsCogan — May 22, 2006 @ 2:11 pm

Comment #101759

Posted by Flint on May 22, 2006 2:23 PM (e)

Yes, the picture is known to be a photoshopped fake, and the event never happened. But the insight Dave gives us is quite priceless, if redundent: *Evidence does not matter*. Sure, it’s false, but so what? It says the right thing, which is really all that matters. In the religious world, things become true when those who want them badly enough SAY they’re true. So that fact that both the story and the pictures are false is beside the point. They’re true, false or not!

Comment #101760

Posted by Stephen Erickson on May 22, 2006 2:24 PM (e)

Somebody tell DaveScot that the word “gullible” is not in the dictionary.

Comment #101761

Posted by bigdumbchimp on May 22, 2006 2:37 PM (e)

The ACLU has certainly stood against prayer in public school even if led by students in extra-curricular settings like graduation ceremonies and football games. There is not one iota of doubt in my mind that the ACLU would love to do the same thing to prayer in the military. Prayers led by commissioned and non-commissioned officers in the Corps are common. The military builds and maintains chapels on military bases. They employ religious clerics whose job is spiritual counseling and leading worship services. Anyone that thinks the ACLU wouldn’t stand against that if they could get away with it needs their head examined. They simply know the American public wouldn’t tolerate it and the ACLU would be so harmed they might never recover as an organization. So they bite their anti-religious tongues in the interest of self-preservation.

Dave, the point here is not that you think that the ACLU does this or that it’s that you presented this obviously faked email, picture and event as fact and then said that facts don’t matter when you were shown to be 100% wrong. Not to mention the deleting of comments.

To everyone who’s pointed out that the ACLU story is a fabrication according to snopes.com - that’s hardly the point.

In your eyes and obviously DI’s eyes ,as long as you think something is true then it’s true. Facts be damned.

What color nose and big floppy shoes is it today Davey?

Comment #101762

Posted by Steverino on May 22, 2006 2:41 PM (e)

I was just checking out UncommonlyDense to see what all the hubbub was about…and noticed Demski’s and Scot’s comments regarding Woody Allen’s Match Point.

Seems like Darwin is responsible for everything!

It’s all making sense now….when the Yanks were up 3-0 against the Red Sox in 2004…and then Sox came back and won 4 straight!….and the time I lost my sunglasses….and my socks disappearing in the dryer!…

How do they find time to do scientific research???…..Oh wait,…nevermind.

Comment #101763

Posted by Coin on May 22, 2006 2:41 PM (e)

That is truly bizarre if even the image is faked. One would think it would not be very difficult to find a real image of marines praying.

Comment #101765

Posted by Tom Ames on May 22, 2006 2:53 PM (e)

Soon to be banned from UD:

#5

You people are retarded.

The email is a fake and you’re an idiot for not realizing that.

Good show, Professor. This type of thing does wonders for your credibility.

Comment by mamoulian — May 22, 2006 @ 2:38 pm

Comment #101766

Posted by Karen on May 22, 2006 3:05 PM (e)

Good show, Professor. This type of thing does wonders for your credibility.

What credibility?

Comment #101767

Posted by Tom Ames on May 22, 2006 3:11 PM (e)

This was the final prod I needed to actually join the ACLU.

Comment #101768

Posted by GvlGeologist, FCD on May 22, 2006 3:13 PM (e)

Mamoulian’s comment has been deleted without note. The dishonesty and cowardice of UD is incredible.

Comment #101770

Posted by Rich on May 22, 2006 3:23 PM (e)

“former Marine Sergeant David Springer, speaking for all his brothers in uniform”

Amazing. He believes he speaks for all marines now. His ego is truely the inverse of his intellect.

Comment #101775

Posted by Jason on May 22, 2006 3:43 PM (e)

OMG, you can tell that it’s a lame photoshop job too!

Comment #101776

Posted by Dave Carlson on May 22, 2006 3:44 PM (e)

BWAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA!!

If Dave Scott wasn’t such a jerk, I’d feel sorry for him.

Comment #101777

Posted by Gerard Harbison on May 22, 2006 3:47 PM (e)

The ironic thing is, the contention that the notorious Texas Air National Guard memos were ‘fake but accurate’ was justly derided from the right. Now DaveScot seems to be claiming this email is ‘fake but accurate’.

Maybe we could all agree that if something is fabricated, it’s of null evidentiary value, no matter how much we happen to like what it says?

Comment #101778

Posted by MaxOblivion on May 22, 2006 3:52 PM (e)

Im going to sue DaveScot, everytime I read something he writes I feel more stupid.

Comment #101779

Posted by Rich on May 22, 2006 3:59 PM (e)

It’s amazing that “Dawkins’s use of hip hop against ID” can get 3 times the responses of this post, despite being much newer. It’s almost as if THEY’RE NOT GETTING THROUGH, or something.

I feel your pain it being cruelly censored by the establishment, ID brothers.

*Does secret ID salute*

Comment #101780

Posted by lamuella on May 22, 2006 4:03 PM (e)

This is truly fantastic. I can’t wait for the follow up where he requests prayers on behalf of the boy who has a burlap sack for a body.

Comment #101790

Posted by GuyJ on May 22, 2006 5:13 PM (e)

That photo looks to be of the marines “quadruplet and quintuplet special forces division” which are known to have big issues maintianing rank and file formations

Comment #101792

Posted by Todd on May 22, 2006 5:16 PM (e)

This is how the post currently reads (a bit of it anyway):

This incident took place at a recent ceremony honoring the Birthday of the Corps, and it has the ACLU up in arms.

He is still claiming the part about the ACLU being upset over this is right. Nothing about it being a rumor, nothing about it being a hoax, he is presenting it as true. The rumor bit is only regarding the quote itself:

says a rumored spokesman for the ACLU

Note he isn’t saying the quote is rumored, only the the spokesman is rumored. It is a minor technicality, but it maintains the tone that this is a real ACLU position.

Comment #101795

Posted by steve s on May 22, 2006 5:29 PM (e)

You notice they’ve put up 7 posts today so far, trying to push the hoax story lower and lower. As a long time watcher of Uncommonly Dense, I can’t ever recall so many new posts in one day.

Comment #101796

Posted by RBH on May 22, 2006 5:30 PM (e)

OK, I’ll make the obvious remark. The title of this post should have been

Design defectives fooled by urban legend

RBH

Comment #101800

Posted by Anton Mates on May 22, 2006 6:18 PM (e)

Syntax Error: mismatched tag 'kwickxml'

Comment #101801

Posted by Anton Mates on May 22, 2006 6:22 PM (e)

Todd wrote:

Nothing about it being a rumor, nothing about it being a hoax, he is presenting it as true. The rumor bit is only regarding the quote itself:

says a rumored spokesman for the ACLU

Note he isn’t saying the quote is rumored, only the the spokesman is rumored. It is a minor technicality, but it maintains the tone that this is a real ACLU position.

How would a “rumored spokesman” work? Do you pay a guy to hold a press conference, then refuse to publicly say he works for you, while paying another guy to send around anonymous letters claiming he is in fact an ACLU spokesman and not a homeless madman?

Comment #101803

Posted by Wheels on May 22, 2006 6:32 PM (e)

Obviously they didn’t apply the Explanatory Filter, otherwise they would have known that the story and photos were Designed. The EF never gives false positives, except sometimes!
Damn that ACLU for being such religious bigots a bunch of atheists Darwinists, enemies of ChristianityIntelligent Design!

Comment #101804

Posted by Coin on May 22, 2006 6:34 PM (e)

Anton Mates wrote:

How would a “rumored spokesman” work? Do you pay a guy to hold a press conference, then refuse to publicly say he works for you, while paying another guy to send around anonymous letters claiming he is in fact an ACLU spokesman and not a homeless madman?

I’m pretty sure that Karl Rove has done exactly that on at least one occasion.

Comment #101808

Posted by Gerard Harbison on May 22, 2006 7:00 PM (e)

What everyone has missed is that if you print out the picture of the marines and hold it about 12 inches from your face, crossing your eyes until an image appears, you can find a secret message from the great Intelligent Designer.

It seems to say ‘So Dark The Con of Man’. Anyone know what that might mean?

Comment #101810

Posted by Chiefley on May 22, 2006 7:15 PM (e)

Why does DaveScot hate freedom so much? (freedom = civil liberties).

Comment #101813

Posted by Sir_Toejam on May 22, 2006 7:24 PM (e)

It seems to say ‘So Dark The Con of Man’. Anyone know what that might mean?

it means Dan Brown’s idea of a mystery isn’t all that special or original?

Comment #101814

Posted by Sir_Toejam on May 22, 2006 7:40 PM (e)

Chiefly asks:

Why does DaveScot hate freedom so much? (freedom = civil liberties).,

simple answer is that he doesn’t. the more complicated answer is a political/social one. If you spend a couple of days looking over Davetard’s posts, I’m sure you’ll see the pattern.

Comment #101815

Posted by John Marley on May 22, 2006 8:00 PM (e)

It’s been said before, but I have to repeat it.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Comment #101816

Posted by burredbrain on May 22, 2006 8:23 PM (e)

Those guys at Unbelievably Dense are their own best argument against evolution: They are simply too dumb to have evolved.

Comment #101817

Posted by Shalini on May 22, 2006 8:28 PM (e)

IDiocy isn’t about religion at all. It’s just about falling for the refuted Marine-praying hoax.

And THAT’S certainly not religion. It’s just those materialistic Darwinists and Judge Jones who say so!

(Tears streaming from my eyes)

Truly, the IDiots are their own worst enemy.

Comment #101818

Posted by Christian Huseby on May 22, 2006 8:36 PM (e)

Are you sure that it is photo-shoped sure they all look alike but then they are all Marines.

Comment #101820

Posted by UnMark on May 22, 2006 9:14 PM (e)

Dave has claimed to be a Libertarian. But just like he claims he’s an agnostic, his words and actions show he’s lying on both accounts. Apply the following filter for Dave and everything comes into focus: Republican == GOOD, Democtrat == BAD.

Comment #101821

Posted by kay on May 22, 2006 10:11 PM (e)

No, no. See, the USMC subcontracted Lucasfilms for the whole clone-trooper thing. After which, Cheney was reported to have bought a cape after adding a rider about the whole shooting-lightning-from-fingers things.

Comment #101822

Posted by Sir_Toejam on May 22, 2006 10:22 PM (e)

Cheney was reported to have bought a cape after adding a rider about the whole shooting-lightning-from-fingers things.

sure it wasn’t the whole “shooting pellets from shotgun into face” thing?

Comment #101825

Posted by Torbjörn Larsson on May 22, 2006 11:21 PM (e)

“They are simply too dumb to have evolved.”

Not if you consider the short perspective. Evolution is about survival. They are adapted to their environment, which being creationist doesn’t need intelligence.

If they seem extraordinarily stupid it could be by a process analogous to sexual selection - the most stupid stand out and gets the best positions. Perhaps it’s a case of “creative selection”.

Comment #101826

Posted by PvM on May 22, 2006 11:36 PM (e)

Dembski’s behavior lately seems quite odd although I think I may understand it. The dismal success of ID combined with the increased evolutionary explanations for biology, and then the somewhat uncritical response to an urban myth must weigh heavy on him. After all, he does not get the fame of a Dawkins who gets a documentary on Channel 4 and has many very succesful books. All he has is Salvador Cordova and Dave Scott. With friends like them who needs enemies :-)

All kidding aside, Dembski seems to be going a bit ‘stir crazy’ now that ID’s dirty laundry has been aired and evolutionary science is moving onward without any scientifically relevant contribution of ID.

It must be hard to someone who was once compared to the Isaac Newton of Information Theory. Little did the people realize that the term information in ID speak merely means, quite appropriately, ignorance.

Keep up the good work Bill, soon you will not need Sal and Dave anymore

Comment #101827

Posted by Sir_Toejam on May 22, 2006 11:44 PM (e)

are we sure he isn’t just setting us up for another “Masterpiece Street Theatre” moment?

ACTING!

(says John Lovitz)

Comment #101830

Posted by djmullen on May 22, 2006 11:51 PM (e)

Just last year summer while I was on vacation in upstate New York and staying at his home for a couple days after our 30th high school reunion, we were struck by lightning at the same time as he was changing the front disc brakes on his wife’s SUV. The lightning hit a power line near the house, travelled into the garage and to the vehicle through the cord on a trouble light, and knocked the crap out of both of us as we were in contact with the vehicle. It might have made him a bit more religious all of a sudden as he had both hands on bare metal whereas I was just touching a painted surface with one hand.

You’d think that a God-fearing man would recognize a clear warning like this one.

Comment #101832

Posted by steve s on May 23, 2006 12:04 AM (e)

I don’t know what’s on Dembski’s mind. I guessed that Davetard was going to be dismissed months ago. He is a real embarrassment. But perhaps that would be an admission of error. Fine with me, the blog has been (unintentionally) hilarious all year. But check out how they’re also finding it impossible to hide the religion these days http://www.uncommondescent.com/index.php/archives/1147#comments

Comment #101833

Posted by Thanos on May 23, 2006 12:11 AM (e)

I guess the irony that the pea-sized brains of DaveScot and company were intelligently designed, is way over their heads.

Thanos

Comment #101838

Posted by ah_mini on May 23, 2006 3:30 AM (e)

OMG, have you seen the last entry that DaveScot put in the comments section for that article?

“Now that everyone is happy that this article isn’t a fabrication the comments are closed”

Every time I see ID proponents claiming that evolution is a lie, I will point them to this breathtaking intellectual filth :D

Comment #101844

Posted by bcpmoon on May 23, 2006 5:39 AM (e)

I don´t know if the first picture was really photoshopped, but my first thought upon seeing it was: Well, these guys have been marched to a parade ground and are right now shuffling to get exactly in line for inspection or whatever. Praying? Methinks not.

And I wonder, what is the difference in the specified complexity between marching soldiers (some order in space and vector) and lined up (high order in space but no movement). Has Dembski calculated this? Is there intelligence involved? Is this difference in CS different between recruits and veterans? A new field of research opens up!

Comment #101852

Posted by 'Rev Dr' Lenny Flank on May 23, 2006 7:21 AM (e)

But check out how they’re also finding it impossible to hide the religion these days

Well, “hiding the religion” was nothing but a legal ploy anyway. After ID lost its head in Dover, there’s no longer any need for the pretense.

Just like ICR (who also tried to “hide the religion” before it too lost its head in court), DI is now free to preach as much as it wants, and to make its money by selling religious tratcs to the gullible.

Comment #101858

Posted by AC on May 23, 2006 9:05 AM (e)

Gerard Harbison wrote:

The ironic thing is, the contention that the notorious Texas Air National Guard memos were ‘fake but accurate’ was justly derided from the right. Now DaveScot seems to be claiming this email is ‘fake but accurate’.

That mentality in a nutshell: “It’s not censorship/hypocrisy/etc. when we do it!”

Comment #101864

Posted by Keith Douglas on May 23, 2006 9:50 AM (e)

And people still say that being gullible in one fashion doesn’t open up your brain to other crap …

Comment #101865

Posted by Rich on May 23, 2006 9:53 AM (e)

If you put DaveScot’s final comments

“Now that everyone is happy that this article isn’t a fabrication the comments are closed.”,

Through the explanatory filter, you get

“Now I’m so embarrassed let’s pretend this never happened. I know the photos are photo shopped because I’ve been told but I won’t allow those posts. Please, please Bill bang out some more guff above this so it gets pushed off the page. I bet you regret having me as your helper monkey now”

Comment #101868

Posted by Moses on May 23, 2006 10:07 AM (e)

Ha, ha, ha, ha! My dad sent me that. Never mind the obvious tiling from the photoshoped troops, the whole thing is just made up and any idiot with even the slightest skepticsm and spent all of two-or-three minutes trying to figure it out would find out that it’s a totally fabricated urban legend.

Comment #101878

Posted by Rich on May 23, 2006 10:48 AM (e)

Also, notice how all the posts since are by D*mbski, is Davescot allowed to post on his own anymore? It was 70% Davescot a week or so ago..

Comment #101886

Posted by ben on May 23, 2006 10:59 AM (e)

Also, notice how all the posts since are by D*mbski, is Davescot allowed to post on his own anymore? It was 70% Davescot a week or so ago..

Perhaps it’s because DS is so arrogant and blockheaded that he will never admit wrong, so WD (who is apparently willing to occasionally admit some wrong, much the way I am willing to choke down a large handful of rotting banana slugs, as long as someone holds a gun to my head) finds it easier to simply post-bomb DS’s crap off the front page than attempt to argue with his out-of-control sycophant.

And given UD’s QC standards, 50 posts or no posts makes no difference to the quality of the site, since X times zero is always still zero.

Comment #101888

Posted by minusRusty on May 23, 2006 11:11 AM (e)

Just what are the ethics of taking an e-mail message, posting it on a blog, then altering it based on feedback without indicating the alteration in the original message? Sure, he noted he made changes in a reply, but the initial entry doesn’t have any indications that it’s been altered. Needless to say, I’m not too impressed, and the impression that the ACLU is involved certainly hasn’t been significantly diminished.

I personally think a screenshot should be posted of that as well. You know, for comparison sake.

What a wanker!

Comment #101931

Posted by Wheels on May 23, 2006 5:16 PM (e)

-Rusty, are you familiar with the practice of “quotemining?” IDists do this sort of thing frequently, for fun AND for profit.

Comment #101959

Posted by Stuart Weinstein on May 23, 2006 6:40 PM (e)

“Also, notice how all the posts since are by D*mbski, is Davescot allowed to post on his own anymore? It was 70% Davescot a week or so ago..”

Poor Billy.

Good help is hard to find.

Comment #101963

Posted by minusRusty on May 23, 2006 6:50 PM (e)

-Rusty, are you familiar with the practice of “quotemining?” IDists do this sort of thing frequently, for fun AND for profit.

Yeah, Wheels, you’re right. I should’ve recognized the technique from the get-go. *sigh* :-(

;-)

Comment #101970

Posted by Shalini on May 23, 2006 7:21 PM (e)

“Good help is hard to find.”

Especially if your limited brain was intelligently designed.

Comment #102041

Posted by Crabby on May 24, 2006 12:11 AM (e)

Stuart

Your comment should read “God help is hard to find”.

Comment #102044

Posted by Shalini on May 24, 2006 12:17 AM (e)

[Your comment should read “God help is hard to find”.]

Or Stuart, your comment can be modified to “Intelligent help is hard to find”.

Comment #102092

Posted by bob on May 24, 2006 8:12 AM (e)

Uh, why is ID concerned with this…… I mean they are not religious. They’re not religious. They’re not religious. They’re not religious. They’re not religious. They’re not religious.

Comment #102095

Posted by Lars Karlsson on May 24, 2006 9:06 AM (e)

Somebody should make a list with the funniest UD threads ever. This one would surely make it there, just like the unforgettable but mysteriously disappeared thread where DaveScot tried to make everybody accept common descent.

Comment #102107

Posted by steve s on May 24, 2006 10:47 AM (e)

We’ve been joking about that over at AtBC. Uncommonly Dense: Exclusive Fan Edition

Comment #102115

Posted by Faidhon on May 24, 2006 11:59 AM (e)

You know, that marine photo looks kinda like those old stereograms…

I kept squinting for a while, waiting for the phrase “Dave is a retard” to pop out. Now I’m dizzy.

Comment #102119

Posted by j-Dog on May 24, 2006 1:02 PM (e)

BTW… In the wake of the massive blowup outlined on this post, UD has NO, Zero, Nada, No comments or post up today…

Maybe ID fellow sycophants Dembski and Springer are even more cartoon-like and are now hitting each other over the head with baseball bats? !

Heh Heh!

Comment #102120

Posted by Laser on May 24, 2006 1:19 PM (e)

j-Dog:

You mean like Itchy and Scratchy?

Comment #102124

Posted by j-Dog on May 24, 2006 2:10 PM (e)

Laser - Yes, like Itchy and Scratchy, but less intelligent…

Comment #102125

Posted by lamuella on May 24, 2006 2:14 PM (e)

If you wring all the chuckles out of this one, go to the uncommon descent homepage and read the fantastic Henry Rollins tirade posted there.

I love Rollins. I always have. Superb musician, superb writer, frantastic public speaker. And Dembski just committed the footbullet of putting an extended Rollins anti-ID rant front and center on Uncommon Descent. It’s a laugh riot.

Comment #102167

Posted by fnxtr on May 24, 2006 9:08 PM (e)

See, now if Dembski had just run this hoax through his explanatory filter, he could have detected the design.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA(ad infinitum)

Comment #102168

Posted by fnxtr on May 24, 2006 9:18 PM (e)

lamuella:

If you wring all the chuckles out of this one, go to the uncommon descent homepage and read the fantastic Henry Rollins tirade posted there.

Thank you, Lamuella. Rollins needs to set this to music and have it distributed to mainstream rock radio.

Comment #102281

Posted by g on May 25, 2006 11:54 AM (e)

ew